*EPF503 01/30/2004
Transcript: Armitage Says U.S.-China Relations Reflect Growing Confidence
(January 30 CNN interview in Beijing) (2180)

"There's a host of international and some bilateral issues that pull" the United States and China together, Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage said in a January 30 CNN interview in Beijing.

As the two countries work together on such thorny issues as the situation in North Korea and the global health concerns of HIV/AIDS and the SARS virus, he continued, the bilateral relationship has developed into one of mutual confidence.

Armitage noted that both countries do not necessarily always agree on the topic of Taiwan, but he reiterated U.S. opposition to any unilateral action taken by either Taiwan or China that would alter the status quo in the region.

When asked about the potential impact of the upcoming referendum planned in Taiwan, Armitage said the United States was closely studying its context and the wording of its questions.

He said members of the Bush administration "are going to do our utmost to make sure ... that there isn't any conflict that comes about" in the region due to the referendum.

"That's where U.S. efforts will be spent," Armitage said.

Armitage praised China's involvement in the six-party North Korean talks, and said China could also play a meaningful role in the transfer of power and reconstruction of Iraq.

"There is plenty of room on the world stage for responsible world actors," he said.

Armitage said there is a "growing body of trust" among most of the participants in the six-party talks focused on resolving nuclear proliferation issues with Pyongyang.

"I would say that China, South Korea, Japan, and for that matter the Russian Federation have equities as large as our own involved in a peaceful solution," he said.

Armitage said the United States is not ready to consider lifting its fifteen-year embargo on arms sales to China because of human rights concerns there, but expressed hope that "over time that we'll be in a situation where we can change that."

Following is the State Department transcript of the interview:

(begin transcript)

Interview on CNN
Richard L. Armitage, Deputy Secretary of State
Beijing, China
January 30, 2004

QUESTION: Secretary of State Colin Powell has described the current U.S.-China relations as the best in thirty years. Why this remarkable turnaround?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Well we certainly at the beginning of this administration started with rather strange circumstances with the EP3, but I think that through that crisis both the leadership of the U.S. and the leadership here in China realize that we could disagree without being disagreeable and that we could handle great problems with wisdom and with diplomacy. I think that gave us some confidence in each other.

QUESTION: Now China and the U.S. are supposed to be constructive partners, not strategic competitors. So what issues pull you together and what issues divide you?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: I think issues that pull us together clearly are such things as the situation in North Korea, the global health situation, whether it's HIV/AIDS, SARS, things of that nature. So there's a host of international and some bilateral issues that pull us together. What separates us, to some degree, is still the question of Taiwan, clearly. There is some neuralgia here in Beijing about some comments made regarding Hong Kong, and we have some strong views about the question of human rights, things of that nature. So we have to face these squarely.

QUESTION: Why has the U.S. come out so explicitly against the idea of Taiwan independence and the planned Taiwan referendum?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Why has the United States? What President Bush has said is that the United States opposes unilateral activity by either side which alters the status quo. In that regard, we have some serious questions about the planned referendum in Taiwan. Referenda are generally reserved for very difficult and divisive issues, and the wording of the referendum, as I understand it, is neither difficult nor particularly divisive. So it brings about a question of why one would put that referendum forward. So we are looking at it very carefully, and we want to study not only the words which were written on the paper, but also the context in which they are used, the domestic way in which they may be used. It's a very fluid and, one could say, dynamic situation.

QUESTION: So are you worried about a possible confrontation on the Taiwan Straits?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Look, I lost my hair a long time ago. I think to be worried about things is not productive. I get up every morning just like Secretary Powell, just like the President, trying to resolve issues and not worry or fret over them, just take the situation where we are and try to resolve them. So it's not a matter of worry. It's a matter of being alert to issues and doing our best to use wisdom and to be very sober-minded in our approach to difficulties.

QUESTION: Why is it so difficult to?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: You know I learned as a young officer one of the first things a young officer in the military learns is that the platoon leader is never worried, never scared, never lost, never cold. So, you can't let your fears get the best of you. You have to get up and work hard every morning.

QUESTION: And yet, on the Taiwan Strait there is this constant saber rattling and the U.S. could be caught in between.

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Look, we are masters of our own fate. We are not caught in collars. We are masters of our own fate. But we are going to do our utmost to make sure that situation, that there isn't any kind of conflict that comes about. That's were U.S. efforts will be spent.

QUESTION: On the Korean issue, why is it so difficult to reconvene the next round of six-party talks?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Oh, I think there are a lot of historical suspicions that exist. For our part, we are unhappy with what happened in the 1994 Framework Agreement. I think for their part, the North Koreans have very strong suspicions about our motives, and they really do wonder if we want to change their regime though that is not our policy. So it takes time to overcome those questions. And then, in the backdrop of all of this is the neuralgia of a very difficult war fifty-three years ago.

QUESTION: I asked this earlier and I'll ask it again. How did the findings of the group which recently visited North Korean nuclear sites affect the prospect of reconvening the talks?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Well, I don't think it affected them from our point-of-view one way or the other. I can't speak for the North Koreans. We were grateful for those non-governmental civilians who traveled to Pyongyang and latterly came out and briefed us on their observations. Of course, they appeared publicly before the U.S. Congress. But for us it didn't add or subtract greatly.

QUESTION: Did it change the U.S. position on?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: No, it didn't, not at all.

QUESTION: Now, what concrete initiatives or concessions can the U.S. offer to break the impasse on the Korean issue?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: I don't know that it's a question right now of concessions. Certainly we are not talking in terms of that, and I don't think the North Koreans are talking in terms of that. They have talked about the possibility of a freeze, and we have talked about having six-party talks without preconditions. I think from our point-of-view, the U.S. point-of-view, there s a growing body of trust among most of the participants that we are sincere in our search for a peaceful solution. President Bush has said time and again that he is confident that we will have a diplomatic and peaceful solution to this question. And I think that's getting through.

QUESTION: The two sides right now are so far apart. Do you agree that both sides should move toward the middle?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: I think that we have to define ourselves first very clearly and make sure that we understand what the North Korean position is, and they have to understand what our position is. I disagree a little bit with your formulation that there are only two sides. I would say that China, South Korea, Japan and for that matter the Russian Federation have equities as large as our own involved in a peaceful solution. So I think that all sides have to move to a better understanding. That's what we are all about here. We are not in a hurry. We are very patient. We just want to get it right.

QUESTION: What role does China play in this?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: I think China, because it is very much in China's interest, has been able to be not a broker but someone who has the ability to talk with credibility to both sides. I say this is not a favor to the United States. For that matter, it is not a favor to the DPRK. It is something that is dramatically in China's interest and I feel it's very much in the U.S. interest.

QUESTION: China has been active and sometimes proactive in multilateral affairs, diplomatic issues, sometimes upstaging major powers like the U.S. Is that worrisome?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: There is plenty of room on the world stage for very responsible actors. I think that the coming of age of China in the first half of this century might be the most important event that the world will see. To the extent that we have anything to say about it, we want to be a very benign, and a very helpful presence on the world stage. I think that China, who, after all, is one of the few nations besides the United States, except Japan, the Russian Federation, and Great Britain, who truly has global interests, truly. There's plenty of problems in the world and we could use a helping hand.

QUESTION: What role can China play in Iraq? Post-war Iraq?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Well, I think there are several. Certainly China can use her influence to help the Coalition try to bring about a credible transfer of sovereignty to a subsequent Iraqi government. I think that the business interests here in China are very well known and they can take part in a meaningful way through contracts in the reconstruction of Iraq. So I hope the diplomatic presence of the People s Republic of China will soon return to Baghdad and help all of us to bring that country to a peaceful and successful conclusion.

QUESTION: The Bush administration has been issuing nonproliferation sanctions against China. Why?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: We have laws on our books that require that when we find proliferation and we are not able to resolve it requires a certain sanction. China has joined in certain international agreements and, to the extent China follows up on her commitments to those agreements, then there won't be a need for sanctions.

QUESTION: U.S.-China military exchanges have resumed robustly in past few months and yet the U.S. still maintains its fifteen-year arms sales embargo on China. Why?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: There are a lot of responsibilities and heavy commitments that come with being a world leader. We take very seriously our commitment to human rights and the embargo on arms to China is out of that human rights concern. It is our opinion that things aren't ripe yet for a lifting of that embargo. We have had very in-depth discussions with China about the human rights situation in China. We are very hopeful over time that we'll be in a situation where we can change that.

QUESTION: Many Chinese, including officials, academics, tourists, and students have complained that they find it virtually impossible to get U.S. visas nowadays. Why is that so and how is that affecting bilateral exchanges?

DEPUTY SECRETARY ARMITAGE: Well, this is not simply an issue for China. This is an issue we face with some of our closest friends. I think the candid answer is that after 9/11 the United States, reeling from that hard attack, started exporting something that is not typically American, and that is we started exporting our fear and our anger instead of our optimism and our hope and our sort of welcoming nature. That pendulum, I believe, swung way too far one way and we are working rigorously to get it to swing back. So I understand the complaint. It's a very valid one. We are working with the U.S. Congress and with Homeland Security to do the best we can to protect our nation, but also to return to the kind of welcoming feelings that we used to exhibit to the world.

Thank you.

(end transcript)

(Distributed by the Bureau of International Information Programs, U.S. Department of State. Web site: http://usinfo.state.gov)

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